Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:02):
All right guys. So I'm here with Matt and John from Givegame.com and Matt is extremely experienced entrepreneur and he's working on his new project. He's working with salesprocess.io To help with some of the sales systems as well. And yeah, in this interview, we're going to learn about John's story or sorry, Matt story, and how he got here. Some of the interesting problems that he's working on and hopefully provide some useful insights to the audience. So Matt and John welcome. And yeah, Matt, why don't you kick it off? Kick us off with your story.

Speaker 2 (00:42):
Yeah, yeah. So I'm a bit of a serial entrepreneur. You know, this idea though Givegame came out of an online payments company that I co-founded that's grew over 20 years time, literally one of the survivors of the first.com, if you can believe it. And while I was CEO of that company, it was called yap stone and it's still privately held a hundred plus million revenue company. One of the acquisitions we did was actually an online giving platform that was focused on churches and it was called parish pay. And it was a situation where they had built a platform that was great for the bookkeeping, the back office side of keeping track of who paid, but the consumer facing experience was awful. I mean, they just really made it difficult for people to just go in and make that one time, make that recurring type offering.

Speaker 2 (01:29):
And so what we realized was, Hey, as a symptom of the experience for giving and was very similar to what we experienced in the real estate industry, which was fleeting, abstinence was all about, was making easier for renters to pay their rent electronically versus by paper check, which was very common at the time. And so we thought the same discipline that we had brought to the consumer experience for paying rent, we could also apply to giving. And what we found with Paris pay was that this is a bigger endemic problem with the entire nonprofit industry. There's tons of examples of nonprofit websites that you get really excited about what they're doing, how they're trying to help society in some way, but then when you just simply want to give $10 $25, they put you through this credit card form that may ask for 20 pieces of information, most of which is not even necessary to go through the process.

Speaker 2 (02:15):
And when you think about that experience, particularly for, you know, a millennial or gen Z type giver they're not going to tolerate that type of having to fill out 20 fields to, to make a simple contribution. And so, so with Givegame, we thought, okay, how could we leverage the gamification the elements that make can make giving fun by leveraging the biggest sports in the pop culture events that go on throughout the year? So this is every major sporting event. So everything from the big ones, the super bowl March madness just was a few weeks ago, Kentucky Derby to every a week of the NFL, golf's tennis, NASCAR, Stanley cup finals, you name it. But then we extended it to also do things like Hollywood award shows. So we do the Academy awards, Emmys, the VMAX, the country, music awards, et cetera.

Speaker 2 (03:01):
And then finally reality TV shows. So the bachelor, the bachelorette, all these kinds of fun shows that people could watch as groups anyway. And so it was a situation where we, we built this platform. I will say that compared with, I think a lot of other startups that are able to kind of do more proof of concept and MVPs. The one thing about mobile gaming is, is that by the time you want to actually get feedback from customers, you know, the product has to be at a certain level. I mean, there's a much, much higher bar when it comes to gaming than the reviews would just kind of throwing up a forum and seeing how many people convert. And so we, in a lot of ways overbuilt the product before we tested a lot of the theses. And we originally thought, well, this is going to make it so much easier for non-profits just by sharing a link to raise money by using, let's say March madness or the Superbowl or Kentucky Derby to actually get donors, to make their picks, make a donation.

Speaker 2 (03:54):
And then they have the fun when the actual event begins of watching the leaderboard to see how their picks do. What we quickly learned though, was is that a lot of the nonprofits are still very tech phobic. They're very accustomed to their in person events and a lot of the ways they traditionally would fundraise. It's an interesting thing and that with the pandemic, I mean, it shut us down for a period of time because none of the events were going on, but then the need for what we do actually significantly increased because those causes couldn't do the in-person events. They still can't in many cases. And so they're looking for ways to do online giving many of these that relied on those in-person events are literally throwing up an online forum and hoping people will contribute to be generous. But reality of it is, is that they're not really well equipped to do that.

Speaker 2 (04:38):
And so there's a huge need for what we do as it relates to nonprofit schools, really any organization who wants to raise money, that's a registered five Oh one C3 nonprofit. So we have a direct connection through an API to the two and a half million nonprofits. So anybody can play to support a registered nonprofit. You simply can't do it, like go fund me where it's just for a personal hardship reason. It has to be to, to support. And so, but what was interesting was is when we found that long sales cycle pre pandemic, we realized as we were about to get to March madness in 2020, when it was canceled, literally two days before that the real market opportunity for us, where people are commercially minded and could absolutely say yes, I want to try this. It's funny enough with companies it's with employee giving, making something funner than, as, as you just mentioned, direct debit from people's paychecks where people don't find that fun or engaging, and they certainly don't have any team building or opportunity to compete with their coworkers by, by giving that way.

Speaker 2 (05:34):
And so with our platform, we can make it easy for really companies of any size to offer almost as an HR amenity, the ability for people to play with each other, which by the way, with working from home, the need for that is just completely skyrocketed because now whether you're on Slack or Microsoft teams, or just on some type of a zoom call, you can share a link, watch the later board kinda trash talk almost and have made a contribution to a nonprofit. And one of the models that we do is we do the traditional where everyone plays for the same. Cause we have another really neat model that tech companies, we think we'll love is where every employee who plays, chooses their personal favorite, non-profit when they make a contribution to the pot. And then whoever scores, the most points wins that game, let's say the Kentucky Derby, or what have you, the winners nonprofit gets the whole pot,

Speaker 1 (06:24):
Which is so it's not

Speaker 2 (06:25):
Like taking an individual contribution to lots of causes it's you don't know. And so now the person who may be volunteers at the cat clinic on the weekend, you know, maybe they contribute $10, but because they won the cat clinic on a thousand dollars,

Speaker 1 (06:38):
Right. That's, that's a really good value prop. How did you arrive to the corporates from the events? Like how did, what was that process like? Well,

Speaker 2 (06:48):
The thing was well with the non-profits and the schools. I mean, we were trying some tests with LinkedIn. We were following people on Facebook. We were DM-ing people when they would mention some type of philanthropy and our event coming up. And what we were trying to pitch them on was how they could use gift game as an adjunct to some other fundraising effort they already had underway. But again, it was one of these things and we're actually funny enough, we're starting to see this even with a corporate decision-makers in that, in fact, John, I was talking about this earlier. There's a difference between the person that may be passionate about, you know, the, the aspect of playing the game or like I love man is I love golf. I love tennis or what have you, I want to play this with my coworkers and the person who necessarily would be the decision maker who would approve this type of product.

Speaker 2 (07:29):
Right. So, so for instance one thing that we're looking at trying right now is really laser targeting, for instance, heads of sales. Because if you think about it, you know, there are the people that are the most competitive. They're probably the person that the pre COVID was running around, selling March madness, brackets, bull squares, and they can say, Hey, I can get all the people on my team excited about doing this. And then if they're successful, they're the ones that are going to kind of sell it up the food chain and their companies to get there.

Speaker 1 (07:56):
So, so

Speaker 2 (07:57):
That's something we're looking at testing, but the other thing, and this is coming from my background with my last company, which again is, you know, over a hundred million revenue company now is I've had a lot of success with channel partner type sales. And so it's talking with, let's say the software providers whose end users could potentially use this, or it could be an extension of some other type of online giving or non-profit technology platform where we can white label it and offer it as a value add, you know, into their base. And so those are the types of channels sales that I've had a lot of success with in the past for me. And this is actually one of the reasons that attracted me to the sales process was I felt like I really needed to learn a lot of the new tactics that people are using to really flush out ideas before throwing a lot of money behind paid advertising and really understanding, you know, what could we do?

Speaker 2 (08:45):
What, how could we fine tune what right now is like a minute sizzle reel on our website, but there's a lot of things that I know we could be doing better. And part of it's like a, it's a high class problem in a way it's also makes it harder is we have so many use cases. We, we don't have a simple market to tap to target. Like we have small, medium and large companies. We're obviously not going to turn down a nonprofit or school who comes in the door and says, yeah, absolutely want to use your platform. But it's a situation where the product really, in a lot of ways, it's almost overbuilt. Like it's got so much great capability. It's got all these mobile gaming, virtual trophy, all these, we can make custom games, we can do all kinds of cool stuff, but we just desperately need distribution. It's not one where we're waiting. You know, we built this and once we get to a hundred customers, then we're going to add some functionality that those hundred customers need. Like, we are pretty certain about what the app, the web app needs to do. And now we simply need to get it out to market and that's influencers. That's, you know, again, it's channel sales through softwares as a whole variety of ways.

Speaker 1 (09:44):
Got it. So who would be like the PERT, like the best customer right now in your, if you were to bring on with one to one archetype who would be the best

Speaker 2 (09:52):
Would be the absolute best well in the nonprofit world, the best customer would be the United way. And the reason why that is, is because every chapter, the United way typically has 200 to 300 companies who are trying to sell their employees in a lot of ways. We're like a software solution that makes it fun and engaging to give to the United way. And so to that extent, we're actually talking to individual chapters too, to try to get them on board with testing this out and giving it a try. On the software side, I mean the ultimate customer for us really would be like a Salesforce as an example, because you know, both with Marc Benioff, being a philanthropist and really being in jazz, not sports, but, but their end users. And then even the companies end users that use Salesforce could absolutely do something like this.

Speaker 2 (10:41):
And so, you know, we've looked at, okay, maybe we have to adapt our web app for the app exchange or for some of these other, you know HR platforms like the Gustos of the world who, who, you know, have some type of an app exchange to try to get out in front of their customers. But it's one of these things where it's easy for us to white label it, you know, we're not trying to build a consumer brand. We've just got something that we just put out there. Anybody self-service can create their own fundraisers. We don't have to do a lot of heavy lifting on our side. So that's where like, from a product perspective, I mean, for the most part, the products built and it doesn't take people to support it. We just need to get users to use it and to keep trying it out.

Speaker 1 (11:18):
Got it. Well, we have a lot of salespeople that listen to, like, we have like a lot on on our list. How would a head of sales users, like what, like, what was the, what would the process look like and how do you think that would motivate the team and increase the morale or output of the day?

Speaker 2 (11:33):
Absolutely. So, so right now it only takes a minute or less to try to Givegame and a gift game. Again, it's just an online fundraiser using an upcoming event to give you an example, right now, we actually have two upcoming events for later this month that you can start fundraising today. One is the Academy awards that's going to be in a couple of weeks. And the other one is actually the NFL draft, which is going to start a week from Thursday. So you can go to Givegame.com. You can start to get game. You simply pick, are we all going to play for the same cause are we going to pick our favorite? Cause individually you pick a game and boom, you're done. I immediately have a live link that you can fundraise with people. Then we'll click the link. They make their picks for those games.

Speaker 2 (12:12):
They make a donation. And then when those games begins, like the w like the NFL draft for us, this begins, I think it's 6:00 PM Eastern on Thursday, a week from Thursday that day it'll shift to leaderboard mode. And then you get to watch as the results of the draft, come in, how your picks did. And so for a sales leader, I mean, this is a great way to say, Hey, you know, this is a way that we can both support a nonprofit. And then for team building bragging rights, we can kind of play with each other and help support help support a great cause. And the process. I mean, our, our pitch with HR folks is wouldn't, you love to be able to endorse, let's say a March madness, a Kentucky Derby type platform where, you know, it's not gambling, you know, you know, if money's involved, it's going to support nonprofits. I mean, we're finally a solution to do that. That's really been purpose built for the, to benefit nonprofits.

Speaker 1 (13:01):
And do you have a case study for a sales team yet? Like, has that, has there been interest?

Speaker 2 (13:07):
Yeah, we've got some video testimonials of different folks that have used it, and we've had everything from, you know, sports reporters have used it to individuals raising money for their favorite nonprofit two different companies where people, you know, have obviously done it with their, with their coworkers. And so yeah, it's, to this extent it's been video testimonials to date. But yeah, it's just one of those things where, yeah. We just need people to kick the tires, give us feedback, tell us how we can make improvements. And really the number one thing is give us ideas about how we could get to this almost like distribution, exit velocity faster, because I feel like there's a lot that we still could be doing. That again, doesn't require having a huge ad spend budget to reach that audience. And so we're very much dependent on social media sharing too. I mean, people immediately have to share on Facebook and Twitter so that as soon as they play every time someone plays, it equates to two and a half donations every time they share it. So it's all about sharing getting the link out to everybody.

Speaker 1 (14:06):
Yep. One question I I have is, so I guess 20 years ago when you were when you were building yap stone how has the process of like building something from scratch changed in that time

Speaker 2 (14:24):
[Inaudible] dramatically? I mean, it's, hence one of the reasons why I wanted to work with you guys. Well, let me tell you, it's changed in two ways. I mean, in one way, you know, w you have stone was much, much more of a, B to B to C type of product, meaning that we were not directly signing up renters. We were signing up, let's say property management firms and then giving them the tools to sell through at the property level. And so going back 20 years ago, that could have been completely offline marketing, to be honest, I mean, patterns literally finding the management companies, you know, who are some of the biggest in the country, elephant hunting first, and then moving downstream. And we did that entirely with an inside sales team. The other thing though, that I'll tell you that made it a lot easier was, is the algorithms of course, you know, for Google, we're not nearly as, as sophisticated and obviously driven to paid advertising as they are now.

Speaker 2 (15:13):
I mean, we, we kind of got early market advantage. We had a great name, Brent payment print, payment.com, and people kind of knew, okay, this is the way I pay my rent online. And so we got a lot of you might say tailwinds and, and getting new customers just because we were one of the first brands for paying rent online. That's certainly helped us quite a bit. And now, you know, what you're dealing is you're, you're competing, particularly when you are going after an end consumer who is ultimately signing up and buying this, like, we're not doing this through an inside sales team. The census is entirely, you know, channel partner type distribution. We, it, it just it's like, how do you do that without having a huge ad budget to, to kind of reach these guys is really the thing, but it's also one of these things that if we do find that secret sauce where, you know, we can pay a dollar and acquire a $10 lifetime value from a customer, we could throw a ton of money at it and, and go after it. We just haven't found that formula yet.

Speaker 1 (16:07):
Got it. And what strategies are you considering right now, right

Speaker 2 (16:12):
Now? So, so what we have done to date and some things that we just need to do more of are things like with LinkedIn, you know, we're, we're doing searches around obviously leaders, sales leaders, VP of HR type of leaders. One thing we found has been successful has done connect requests with a note. So, you know, we don't do any mail in mail, really, we know spam, but the connect request with a note we've had really good acceptance of those. And then of those, you know, we always follow up with an invite to once they accept the request to, to, you know, to go through a demo. The one thing, and this is another challenge that we're trying to solve for is we have a one minute sizzle reel kind of explains how the process works. We also have some cartoon pontoon videos that we did for both companies and for nonprofits, and you can see the website.

Speaker 2 (16:59):
But the other thing is, is that ultimately for signing a real decision maker at a company, it does take this almost 10 to 15 minute consultation, like what we're doing right now. It's not something that always is as intuitive as it ought to be. We also have to overcome this misperception that's gambling. I can't say, I mean, we started with nonprofits who thought that this was gambling and it's not just cause there's a sports connotation. We even had that with companies where we have to explain, Hey, this is a team building opportunity by just sharing a web link, that you can actually drive donations to nonprofits in the process. And, and some people still have that misperception. And so we have to overcome some of those things, but again, a lot of it is getting the decision-maker or the person who has the courage to try something new because we are creating a new dynamic that's never existed before, rather than just having a better trap for some other product that they're already using.

Speaker 2 (17:51):
And that's another thing is we were changing behavior. There's a perception that maybe I give to a cause of once a year, we're now encouraging people to maybe give 10 to $25, but play the game seven to 10 times a year, right. That is a change in behavior unto itself. And so but, but we feel that with this next generation coming into the workforce, like this is the kind of thing that all companies really need to do. And I'll tell you another challenge we have. And I'd be curious to hear how some of your other clients deal with this is that when we talk to people about this and we tell people in a minute at a high level, what it is, everyone loves the idea and there's this aspect of inertia to actually get them to actually move forward and do something.

Speaker 2 (18:32):
And so there's this aspect of, well, I want to wait until let's say March madness rolls around again, instead of trying with the Academy awards, the Kentucky Derby, or, you know, the Olympics the summer, for instance. And so we have to create a sense of urgency, but we, people don't tell us no, or, Oh, no, we have another solution. We're not interested in that type of thing. Right. People in a lot of ways, I wish they would be more honest with us to say, we need to use this, or we don't need it, or we may need it in the future. They always say, wow, that's awesome. Why wouldn't I do that? Yeah. And that in itself causes problems because you just want to get like paid customers through the funnel, get them signed up and then get them as repeat users.

Speaker 1 (19:10):
Yeah. To me, the first question that comes to mind is like how much more output can be created from a sales team by using something like this. Because I ran sales teams, I still run a sales team. And the morale, like if it's huge, if the morale's up and people are excited that it can be like a 50% difference in the output for the, for the month. Right. So like, to me, if that's, that would be the main benefit for us as a salesperson or a sales leader. Right. Like yeah.

Speaker 2 (19:41):
Yeah. Morale, morale booster. And particularly again, when people are still working from home, I mean, I, I feel like we have a window of time to capitalize before things are back to normal in a way when the companies need this type of interaction when they can't have those in-person water cooler, spontaneous conversations like they used to.

Speaker 1 (20:00):
Yep. Cool. Well yeah, it sounds if anyone's listening, they, and their sales later give them a shot. What's your background is it sounds like you're pretty technical. Are you guys engineers? How, how did you get, how did you get to this point?

Speaker 2 (20:17):
How'd I get to this point? Well, I was I was an ISTH major, I mean, going back double major and business analytics and, and and I S never did true full blown computer science. I'm not really a developer, but but I'm definitely what I would consider a certainly a product founder. Like I'm the guy that definitely wants to make sure it does what it needs to do. I'm going to be the type of person though that needs a developer to work with me to kind of build what it needs to do, but things where I'm technical enough to keep them honest. But I also the business guy, I mean, I'm a sales guy you know, finance, I mean, I've had to do everything. And obviously, I mean, when, when I stepped down as CEO, yap stone, maybe we went up to 150 people, a hundred plus million in revenue, and that was seven years ago.

Speaker 2 (20:59):
So, so I've had already done this at scale, and now it's kind of like, it's a lot harder to start completely from scratch all over again. But it's still a, it's just a unique challenge because of what you brought up. It's, it's the difference this time around in how you reach customers get exposure for your product is so different in a lot of ways, it's, it's a lot more challenging. I think if you find this secret sauce in, in, you can really throw gas on the fire. It's amazing. But again, it's like, we're still working to kind of get to that, to get to that point with this one.

Speaker 1 (21:30):
Yep. And having that one channel that, yeah. That really works. What other content strategies are you guys using right now? Like how, how are you getting the word out?

Speaker 2 (21:39):
So, so another thing that we have had some success with, so I've been writing some byline articles with LinkedIn. You know, it's still one of these things where we don't have a lot of followers on Facebook and Twitter. And so it's kinda like we're yelling in a forest and no one's hearing us cause we don't have a lot of here's there, but, but in terms of a LinkedIn, the contents been great because people do tend to like and share and sometimes comment. And then, you know, other people that let's say work in their industry that happened to see it you know, may respond and may want to try it out. That part has been good. You know, one of the things that we would love to have a strategy around is Instagram, but the challenge there is, is that outside of your profile link, you can't really share a link the way you can on Facebook, Twitter, and LinkedIn.

Speaker 2 (22:19):
So and as we kind of might say pivoted to more focus on corporate customers versus individuals and nonprofits that's where we're really thinking, the more we can laser target a certain job description at LinkedIn, that's probably going to be our best channel to reach customers. But we tried some, I mean, we tried some Facebook ad tests. We tried, let's see, I think we did a little bit with Twitter, so sponsored tweets and so forth. And we just didn't have really, really good conversion from that. And that's another reason why at this point, I mean, it's still a bootstrap business. You know, I don't want to throw a lot of money at things that I know are probably not going to work and I to make an investment in sales process because I'm gonna learn something regardless. But I know there are some actual tactical changes that we can make that will have a huge impact. So

Speaker 1 (23:06):
Yeah. Well maybe let's talk about that too. Like as an experienced entrepreneur, when like, and I can tell by just, I could be wrong, but it sounds like you execute pretty quickly when you ha when you have an idea, you can move pretty quickly. Maybe talk about the pace at which one must move to, to validate something and when, to what signal to look for when it's not working.

Speaker 2 (23:30):
Right. Well that's kind of a hard thing for me to answer because I feel like, you know, because I have been working on this for a couple of years it's just that the last year we were on pause because of the pandemic, so that events we couldn't test and verify. And a lot of the things that we're, you know, we're, we're experiencing now you know, we will learn something new every day. I, I think again, I think it's just contacting and reaching out and actually cold emailing, calling customers and actually hearing what they say. Trying to understand why, if they don't want to sign today, why, why are they gonna wait, you know, talking to a theater, nonprofit, and they're going to wait until the Tony awards rolls around, or it's just somebody else who just says, Hey, you know, I'm just collecting information on behalf of somebody else.

Speaker 2 (24:14):
And that's where, you know, the thing that I think we're learning is we need to really hone in on where both the person who's jazzed about the experience and bringing it to their team because they liked sports and they liked reality TV themselves also in a way, has the decision making ability to actually green this. So they're not the one that's collecting information. What are then it loses momentum. The moment they try to kind of push it up. The food chain we were finding as we test this, instead of just shooting for the most senior HR leader, we need to get more people at our department level to test it. And then when they're successful, the whole company is going to hear about it and they're going to want to blow it up that way. But like I said, I mean, we do have, by the way, our revenue model we take a 10% platform fee on behalf of the donations that come in and give people the opportunity to tip their donation, to cover that fee.

Speaker 2 (25:03):
Really our cost of goods is the credit cards, fees, the payoffs fees maintain the platform. And we do have a SAS model to which, to this point, we actually don't have customers that actually have, have started paying for it because a lot of them started with us with March madness on a 30 day trial. And now based on the size of the organization, we do a 99, one 99, two 99 a month programming. Then we'd lower the platform from 10 to 7%. So we haven't done a lot of testing on, you know, is that really the right price points? And how much is that discouraging people from signing up in the first, in the first place? You know, the landing pages that we've done or we've tested with have tried to bend through non-profit tech platforms where their customers will see it and it'll say, Hey, this is another way I should be fundraising. As a nonprofit we need, we need more landing pages. We need a lot of,

Speaker 1 (25:51):
I guess, what I was getting at is it sounds like you're like you can build products. You've done well building products. So the speed at which you build the product, how like some, some of our customers and some listeners might be struggling with that part. Right. Cause you're, you're, you can, it sounds like you're getting data and you're, you can sell them, get appointments and get feedback, but maybe, maybe speak to how fast is one need to move in the product building phase once you found it. Like how, what are some of the strategies that you've learned over the years to, to turn that? Yeah.

Speaker 2 (26:22):
Yeah. Well, I mean, you know, obviously, you know, in a kind of a two to three week sprint mentality is, is kind of the, what we've done with certain features. I mean, you know, obviously taking all feedback that we possibly can and baking that into what requirements we're going to review before we kind of go in another sprint. You know, like I was saying though, in hindsight, looking back at this, I mean, there's more customer validation that, that we should have done again, pre pandemic before, you know, we realized that, Hey, companies are really the market we need to go after. And so when non-profits, weren't moving quickly, that should have been a signal to us to start selling into the corporate market sooner than we did. But no, you know, making the product changes is I think extremely important. I think you know, just testing different messaging with kind of a lackluster product, isn't necessarily going to tell you that one message works over another, if the product itself isn't great.

Speaker 2 (27:17):
But again, I feel like, like I mentioned, beginning with your oil to a higher bar than somebody who's like, just throwing up, let's say like, you know, a Quizzlet or throwing up some type of survey monkey to really understand, Hey, if, if I built this, would you buy it? I mean, he had to show something to people that they had never experienced before in a way. And they had to feel like, yeah, I can make picks and donate 30 seconds or less. This is way better than filling out that huge credit card form. I had fun and I supported a nonprofit. And so in that vein, I mean, we had to overbuild the product before we could validate some of these theses. And that's where funny enough, looking back in hindsight, I wish we would have scaled back what we built to validate certain things sooner.

Speaker 2 (28:01):
So we would have pivoted some changes to the product for corporate faster, but more importantly started really going after customer acquisition faster. It's just that now that we're coming out of the pandemic and things are sort of coming back a little bit to normal. Now we've got people that are interested. I'll tell you an example though, like with schools, schools still are not interested. Schools are still dealing with reopening right now. So if we were to talk to one or, or let's say did some type of targeted campaign around school development directors, I mean, they're probably still not gonna be interested because they're still dealing with the reopening issues. They're just riding the storm until things are back to normal. Whereas like with companies, companies are preparing for people to come back or getting back to normal. And so you know, they're more open to what's going on.

Speaker 1 (28:46):
Got it. Okay. So if where should someone who should someone contact if they're interested in signing up? I think we could maybe help with getting some salespeople interested. If, if you guys are listening to the sales leaders, if you want to fire up your sales team, where can they go? Is it a, just give, getting.com it literally.com?

Speaker 2 (29:09):
Yeah. Yeah. You can also, yeah. My my emails, Matt dot golis@giftgame.com and and yeah, and, and right from the platform, and this is a totally self-service platform. There's nothing we have to set up for anyone. You can go, you, you just pick what cause you want to support you pick, do you wanna play the NFL draft? He kept me awards. We'll have the Kentucky Derby by the way in a week or so. And then, you know, you have a link that you immediately share and then all the way up until the NFL draft or the Academy war starts your fundraising and everyone who supports that you can watch the winter board. And then the day after the event's over the game's over that's when we do the payout to the nonprofit. And so so the nonprofit gets paid quickly.

Speaker 2 (29:51):
Non-Profit also benefits because they get to learn who supported them when they played the gift game as well. So every everybody wins. It's a, it's a great solution. And again, it's completely self-service. And that's another thing that, from a feedback, it user feedback perspective would be super helpful to us because we're still, you know, wondering, okay, are there things that are tripping people up that they're not getting through? What for us takes less than a minute to create? Cause we do them for demos all the time. If you were seeing this for the first time, what part of it wasn't intuitive? What part of sharing the link and getting people invited in to compete and go, you know, tap team building, what part of it wasn't easy. And the more we do that, you know, the more we can fine tune the product in the process. Awesome. Well Matt, that's a great, great story. I think it's an awesome problem that you guys are solving and yeah, I'm I'm happy to to push this to our audience and see if we can help in any way. Any questions before we we end the interview.

Speaker 2 (30:52):
I think we're good. Awesome guys. Well, I appreciate the time and yeah, we'll end it here. All right. Thanks so much, Nick. We appreciate it.

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